Author Topic: Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?  (Read 4941 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline TAluvr

  • Jr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« on: September 08, 2006, 03:33:40 PM »
Hello all need some advise, in the process of bidding on a 1978 400/4SPD NON-ttop car.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260029411653

My question is how to be sure if this is a true WS6/W72 car. Can the Vin tell you anything? 2W87Z8L170111 the guy selling said he thought this might be a WS6, can you have one option without the other?

Any help at all would be appreciated, this seems like a sweet TA and Im over having T-Tops like I have now, theres little to do to kill the rattles and Im spending a fortune on that. Out with the old in with the NEW!  :P

Offline HughJass

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 378
  • Geoff
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #1 on: September 08, 2006, 08:35:18 PM »
Its  has the 7"rims on it so unless the 8"rims got replaced, I would say, it's not a WS6. I know in 79 you couldnt get a W72 without a WS6 but not sure about 78.
Light travels faster than sound. That's why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.



79 W72 WS6,  work in progress - nicknamed Lucy

Offline Hitman

  • Administrator
  • Lifetime Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8256
  • Referrals: 0
    • http://www.78ta.com
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2006, 09:04:25 PM »
Well, he never states in the auction that the car is a WS6 car.  He does state that it is a W72 car, but never says it is a WS6.  Now, from the looks of the engine it does have the chrome valve covers that came on the W72 engine.  The L78 engine valve covers were painted to match the engine.  Now of course it is easy to replace the valve covers so here are two things that you can do..... 1. Ask for the number off the engine, if it is an X7 or WC, then it is a W72 Pontiac 400 from 1978.  If it is a YA or YU, then it is an L78 400 from 1978.  Check this page for more information:http://www.78ta.com/enginecodes.htm .  If it is not ANY of those numbers, then it is not the original engine for the car so all of that does not matter anyway. 2. You can contact Pontiac Historical Services to get the documents to prove what the car is or isn't (www.phs-online.com).  Now, another thing to consider is that the 1978 Trans Ams that were 4 speed cars ONLYT came with the W72 rngine.  You could not get the 4 speed with an Olds 403 OR the L78 Pontiac 400.  So, if it is a true 4 speed car and it has the original engine, then it MUST be a W72 Pontiac 400.
Now for a quick check on if the car is a WS6 car, then ask him to read the part number off of the top of the steering box.  You can easily see the number by looking in the engine compartment.  The GM part number is right on top of the steering box.  The WS6 box is part number 7829773 (at least that's the 78 part number).  So, have him read you that number to see if it matches.  Hope this helps.  Let me know if you need anything else.
Brett Campbell
"Hitman"
www.78ta.com
www.ohiofirebirds.com
www.tanationals.com
1978 Trans Am

Offline TAluvr

  • Jr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2006, 11:54:29 PM »
So Bret whats your opinion of this car, if anyone knows the 78 its you! Have you seen this car anywhere in your circles? Does this car have any value if taken to the next level? Im talking long term upkeep investment? Is it worth 15k? He also told me he took the WS6 rims off because he liked this style better and traded with someone, or something like that, but I have a pair of the WS6 rims I think Bret restored at one point, theyd look awesome on this car. Scary buying over the net! He says it has the P225-70-R15 tires, I understand that suppose to mean something according to a book by Thomas E. Bonsall - Firebird A Source Book it says on page 121 WS6 Performance Package includes these particular size tires shown on the door jam.

IM SO CONFUSED!  :shock:

Offline TAluvr

  • Jr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2006, 12:42:26 AM »
Gotta admit if one was launched at the Detroit Auto Show  for 2007-08 we'd be all over it! Frigging Black Diamonds!


Offline Hitman

  • Administrator
  • Lifetime Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 8256
  • Referrals: 0
    • http://www.78ta.com
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2006, 09:34:39 AM »
You really have to ask yourself if the car is worth it to you.  It looks like a nice car for being an SE clone, but the photos don't really show alot.  Some of the photos raise some questions on the actual mileage of the car, but overall it looks to be a nice looking Trans Am.  So.... is it worth it to YOU?
Brett Campbell
"Hitman"
www.78ta.com
www.ohiofirebirds.com
www.tanationals.com
1978 Trans Am

Offline John Witzke

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 269
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2006, 09:52:15 AM »
I can tell from the engine picture the cylinder heads are not 6X.  Also incorrect air cleaner style for a 1978 W72 car
John Witzke

Offline TAluvr

  • Jr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #7 on: September 09, 2006, 11:12:38 AM »
Ya you guys are good at bringing things to reality, a nites sleep helped to, not as eager as I was yesterday. Guess Im going to hold off for now. Im dieing to find a Trans Am that is in the best original condition. I definitely dont want to buy an Ebay lemon or clone! I loved the way it looked and got caught up into it, but to spend 12-15k on the absolute unknown is kinda nuts, but the car definitely shows well with photos and I know how deceiving that can be.

Does anyone know the production numbers in 1978 regarding 400/4spd?

Hitman you said the miles might not be accurate? What makes you believe this?

Bottom line is this the type of TA that would increase in value over time? Anytime I think about buying a 78 TA this is the first site I hit!

Offline ta78w72

  • Lifetime Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6297
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #8 on: September 09, 2006, 11:22:47 AM »
The rear anti sway bar doesn't look like 3/4 inch.  Ask him to measure it.   Also, ask him to turn the steering wheel lock to lock.  A true WS6 car will be 2.5 turns.  Those two things, along with the correct decal in the door, would point to the WS6 suspension.  However, if this originally had a manual transmission, it was a W72 car.  It does appear that the engine has been meddled with.  And, I don't understand why they would change the air cleaner base.  The fuel intake line isn't insulated either.  It would be odd for a 72K car to have had some major engine work as this appears to have had.  The A/C isn't working either.

This car, in my opinion, isn't worth anywhere near $15K.  I, like Brett, would be very leary of the mileage.  But it does look like a solid car.  Don't expect to buy it and not have to put money in it though.  If the tranny hasn't been rebuilt...it's time.  Who knows what the engine is like.  You'll have lots of supsension issues too.  All normal for 30 year old cars.

Offline TAluvr

  • Jr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #9 on: September 09, 2006, 11:42:11 AM »
At first he says he will close the auction at 13500.00 reserve is 15k then says he wouldnt as there is a guy in Texas that has offered 14k so now he wants to let the auction run its course.

One of the main reasons I liked this car is that he said it was tight with no rattles, after having a 1980 T-top TA that was music to my ears!

Who knows the more I think about it the crazier it makes me! Maybe Ill wait for the Barrett Jackson show again, but man they are way over priced at that show!

Offline ta78w72

  • Lifetime Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6297
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #10 on: September 09, 2006, 12:36:32 PM »
Someone saying they'll give you $14K is vastly different than someone giving you $14K.  See what the auction brings.  Bid if you like the car and have the money to spare.  I've always figured it was better to find a nice solid car and pay a little extra than to pay less for a car with RUST problems.   I hate rust.

Offline John Witzke

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 269
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2006, 01:46:16 PM »
There were 12,692 Trans Ams produced during the 1978 model year with W72 and 4-speed manual transmission.

Also during the 1978 model year your could get a W72 Trans Am without WS6.  For 1979 that changed as WS6 was a mandatory option as was J65 4-wheel disc brakes and 4-speed manual transmission.

Don't be in a hurry to jump and buy.  Ask questions is not sure as several of us can help with whats correct and whats not.
John Witzke

Offline TAluvr

  • Jr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #12 on: September 09, 2006, 02:06:17 PM »
Believe me brother I know you guys know your stuff thats why I come around and ask!  :wink:

I hear what your saying, what I was hoping out of this is to get 10k miles and let my wife get used to it and then sink some money into it. I know it will need ticky tacky stuff along the way. If I had the money Id go for that 1979 Trans Am Blue with 7025 miles or that other one with 4500!

I was able to get the cowl tag its big so Ill just post the link, I have asked him to send me one more clear however even as blurry as it is it does not look like Hitmans cowl info.


http://www.quicklysell.com/++Joes%20Files/untitled2.bmp

Offline John Witzke

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 269
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #13 on: September 09, 2006, 02:12:28 PM »
Code 24 for paint is Martinique Blue
John Witzke

Offline TAluvr

  • Jr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 67
  • Referrals: 0
Hitman? True WS6/W72 car?
« Reply #14 on: September 09, 2006, 02:16:32 PM »
Nuff Said thanks!