Author Topic: 4 Relay power window installed!!  (Read 21394 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline lee01

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 444
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #30 on: June 07, 2008, 08:57:00 AM »
Neat place too to install these relay.  8)
Glad to hear the diagram help!  :D
Current project:
90 Mustang GT 5.0
10 STI Sportech
Last T/A's
1979 x 4

Offline N PRGRES

  • Adv. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2569
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #31 on: June 14, 2008, 04:33:36 PM »
Since I am new to the TA world, why do you do this mod?
Dave
_______
1981 Trans Am - Refresh in progress

Offline Joker (§ir£Ğragon)

  • Lifetime Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4994
  • When you think it can't get any worse...God laughs
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #32 on: June 14, 2008, 07:51:15 PM »
Since I am new to the TA world, why do you do this mod?

The original design was horrible. They run the power directly through the switch to the window. That means the entire load goes through the switch. They also use no ground wire. Instead the window motor is grounded to the door and uses the hinges to complete the circuit to the chassis. Dirty/worn hinges (which are normal for cars with such heavy doors) means the ground deteriorates. This causes the load on the circuit to increase. So more load on the switches. That's why F-body windows are so slow. And why a lot of people have problems with their window switches burning out. This design takes the load off the switch and creates a much better ground.
Larry


Offline Joker (§ir£Ğragon)

  • Lifetime Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4994
  • When you think it can't get any worse...God laughs
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #33 on: June 14, 2008, 07:55:11 PM »
Mounting inside the console would have been neater and easier to access but the electrician I had working on my car didn't have the console and so came up with this instead. This is directly behind the glovebox, mounted onto the firewall top. Also note that this is a RHD car so this is basically where your steering column would normally be.
One other problem I had to adjust was that with new motors, the windows operate so fast and hit the lower bump stops a lot harder than before, there is a lot of flex in the door shell sheetmetal. After having one window nearly jam under the felt guides, I had to adjust the bump stop a little higher so the relays cut the power just as the glass disappears below the seals.
Thanks guys, another thumbs up for the wiring diagram!



This is very similar to how I'm doing mine. I never use a glove box. Especially when I have a center console. And I don't have a good inner liner for it. So I'm going to make a relay board for things like the windows, locks and any other circuits that need them. I'll probably install the fuse box there too since I'm rewiring the whole car from scratch. I hate working under the dash. And if I do that I won't have to squeeze my 230lb butt under there. lol ;)
Larry


Offline N PRGRES

  • Adv. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2569
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #34 on: June 15, 2008, 10:56:16 AM »
Great thanks for the heads up!  My TATA gets here next week and I can tell this forum will be a huge help!
Dave
_______
1981 Trans Am - Refresh in progress

Offline 79transam92

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 338
  • Referrals: 0
    • my myspace
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #35 on: December 29, 2009, 11:21:35 PM »
sweet
1979 T/A, 403 engine, posi tract, needs interior and body work, needs paint, an engine rebuild couldn't hurt, needs the nice weather of summer again, BTW, I have a 94 Chevy Silverado also

Offline ta78w72

  • Lifetime Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6297
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #36 on: December 30, 2009, 12:18:21 PM »
Since this just popped up with "sweet", I thought I just mention that the original relay seen attached to the firewall along with the new relays needs to be grounded.  The new relays have a ground wire while the original relay is grounded via the metal housing to the column support.  If the relay "floats" the windows won't work.  I realize the relay in the above picture is grounded to the firewall.  I thought I just point out that the relay must be grounded to work because it's not really self evident.

Offline Aus78Formula

  • Adv. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2274
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #37 on: January 02, 2010, 04:36:49 AM »
...And this is behind my glovebox, not in place of it. Its also a RHD converted car so not sure what space is there usually.

Offline 78ta

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 970
  • The 8 track and gauge/stereo console adapter guy.
  • Referrals: 1
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #38 on: January 02, 2010, 05:55:27 AM »
I know a lot of us are dieing for them to come out with a reproduction dash pad. What in the world do you guys do to/with the dash when you convert them to RHD? !
Any pics?
« Last Edit: July 20, 2010, 07:01:15 PM by 78ta »
Randy

Offline Eagle 1

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 1455
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #39 on: February 03, 2010, 11:38:13 PM »
Well I finaly got around and finish my power window 4 relay setup.  ;D

I found out that my driver side motor need to be either replace or rebuilt. But I manage to do a little 4 sec video of my passenger side going down. Oh!! Did I mention it was the first time in over a decade that this window didn't move!!
To make matter worst, i'm only running this test on my soso battery (11volt)

Good thing about this 4 relay setup, the volt gauge didn't even buldge when I power the window down!! Now that a first.
Plus I realize that I haven't finish connection my new door to chassis ground!  :-X

So its working really good at it is, imagine with full recharged battery, good ground and clean & grease window run.

Here my setup:






-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm just wandering if you have a video of it going up?
Mine go down that fast with out relays.


" He done good didnt he Fred?"
"I'm in pursuit of a black Trans Am. He's all mine so stay outta the way."

Offline Aus78Formula

  • Adv. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 2274
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #40 on: February 05, 2010, 06:27:30 PM »
I know a lot of us a dieing for them to come out with a reproduction dash pad. What in the world do you guys do to/with the dash when you convert them to RHD? !
Any pics?

All from scratch, sometimes sections of original below the surface but usually smoothed over in fibreglass which mine is. Mine is also trimmed in leather which eliminates the problem of dash caps of cracking vinyl. These cars are at the age now where a LHD car can be driven over here. I'd possibly stay that way if it were a low-mileage car and original dash but I'll keep my RHD for general ease of cruising plus it has a lot of custom mods to suit, won't find many with working A/C and demister for example!

Offline 1979transam

  • Jr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #41 on: July 19, 2010, 05:18:53 PM »
I want to do this to my windows asap. Couple questions though....

Did you keep the original power running to just the switch then run another power to the relays? Or did I misread the diagram?

Also how are you guys attaching your grounds to the motors? Any pics?

Thanks big time

Offline rhino33

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 507
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #42 on: July 19, 2010, 05:41:17 PM »
I unplugged the wire on the fuse block- the orange/black then i made a small tail with # 10 and plugged it back in then I just maretted the orange/black to that with a new #10 to the center console. that way you have a 30 amp cct for your relays and still have the power window switch through the relay under the dash, I just made a new chassis ground under the console for the new relays
this worked well for me

Offline birdseye78

  • Member
  • **
  • Posts: 130
  • Referrals: 0
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #43 on: September 16, 2010, 10:00:19 AM »
Here's the link to the web site that has what I think is the best price for the relays. http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=330-073 Also check out the drop down menu below the pic of the relay. They also offer pigtails (plugs with wires already attached) to simpify wiring if you have to remove or replace a relay in the future.


[/quote]

I did purchase the pigtails for the relays. My question is the guage of the wiring that comes from the pigtails. From the switch, it looks like a 14 guage +/-, and following the schematic, the pigtail wires from the 86 side for power up and down are a lot lighter guage. Is this a concern, or am I o.k.? The 87 and the 30 sides are a lot thicker guage, similar to the harness and the switch wires.

Offline 78ta

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 970
  • The 8 track and gauge/stereo console adapter guy.
  • Referrals: 1
Re: 4 Relay power window installed!!
« Reply #44 on: October 22, 2010, 11:32:38 PM »
Quote
I did purchase the pigtails for the relays. My question is the guage of the wiring that comes from the pigtails. From the switch, it looks like a 14 guage +/-, and following the schematic, the pigtail wires from the 86 side for power up and down are a lot lighter guage. Is this a concern, or am I o.k.? The 87 and the 30 sides are a lot thicker guage, similar to the harness and the switch wires.
Haven't visited the board in a while. I hope you've already found an answer.
According to ampacity charts I've seen, 14 gauge stranded wire can carry up to 40 amps in a 12 vdc circuit. 16 gauge can carry 20 amps.
The 86 and 87 are the signal wires meaning that they just tell the relay to actuate(connect) the 85 and 30 contacts so there is very little current passing through the wires going to 86 and 87. They could be as small as 22 gauge (5 amps).
All the power to drive the motors is going through 85 and 30 so they need to be 14 gauge or larger. This is the very reason for this modification. Now, the heavy current draw is NOT going through the switch which causes them to go bad. Now the relay is carrying all the current for the motors.
Randy