Topic: Steering Wheel Horn Collar

[Bull]

I am not sure what the exact term is, but the pics will show what I am talking about.

Do you guys see anything obviously wrong with the way the collar is sitting on the column?  To me, it doesn't seem like it is seating fully.  The resulting problem is that the little metal plunger for the horn is not sticking up far enough to make contact with the pivoting horn switch.  But, I am not sure why the collar isn't seating.  What do you guys think?

[Grand73Am]

Yes, it should go on further. The first obvious thought is, have you tried putting the nut on and tightening it more to see if the hub will go on further?

One other thing I see is that your mark on the steering shaft isn't lined up with the mark on the hub, so you need to pull the hub and line those up so your steering wheel will be straight. You could also make sure the splines are clean and there's nothing under there that's interfering while you're at it. 

[Bull]

Thanks for your reply.  Yes, I did put the nut on and crank it down to what I considered to be a "pretty darn tight" torque value.  I didn't want to strip anything or twist the steering column out of whack.  But, the nut reached a point where it didn't feel like it was going any further, and so the collar was not going any further, either.

I didn't even know about the marks to line up...when I am looking at the parts in front of me, will it be obvious how to align them?  I guess I mean, do I just put the key in the ignition and turn the splined shaft in such a way that the collar will mount with its mark aligned with the shaft's mark while at the same time being position for the horn plunger to go through its mounting hole?  I hope that isn't too poorly worded.

I did gawk around a bit and spent some time cleaning the splines with steel wool and then a wire brush.  Nothing seems damaged or anything.

Yes, it should go on further. The first obvious thought is, have you tried putting the nut on and tightening it more to see if the hub will go on further?

One other thing I see is that your mark on the steering shaft isn't lined up with the mark on the hub, so you need to pull the hub and line those up so your steering wheel will be straight. You could also make sure the splines are clean and there's nothing under there that's interfering while you're at it. 

[Grand73Am]

No, to realign those marks, you would have to pull your hub off, and then reinstall the hub. Turn the hub so it lines up the mark on the top end of the steering shaft with the mark on the center of the hub. You can see the marks that have to line up in your pictures. It's those 2 lines. So, it doesn't involve turning the ignition key or turning the shaft.

[Bull]

No, to realign those marks, you would have to pull your hub off, and then reinstall the hub. Turn the hub so it lines up the mark on the top end of the steering shaft with the mark on the center of the hub. You can see the marks that have to line up in your pictures. It's those 2 lines. So, it doesn't involve turning the ignition key or turning the shaft.

I do see the marks that you mention.  My confusion might be because I am in front of a screen, and not in front of the parts themselves.

Since the horn contact button has to pass through one very specific, small hole in the base of the hub, I was using that hole as my guide for how the hub needed to be positioned....

Sincerely,

Dense Dave

[Grand73Am]

Your marks aren't way off, but look like a spline or 2 off. They're supposed to be lined up so that when the steering wheel is straight, the steering gear is centered. And if you get an alignment done, the steering wheel is placed in the straight position and the alignment is done while keeping  the wheel straight. That way you're wheel is straight when you go straight down the road.

The horn button doesn't matter as far as the positioning of the hub.

[Bull]

Is the green tube into which the horn contact button and spring go somehow connected to what is called the "cancel cam?"

Whatever the correct terminology, I am having some trouble getting my horn to work.  There were two problems along the way so far: the button had been installed incorrectly, there was no relay in place.  Once those were ironed out, I still couldn't get the horn to work.  To me, it seemed like the little actuator plunger wasn't sticking up far enough.

But, I no longer believe that is the problem.  If I hold one end of a wire on the steering shaft, and touch the other to the contact button, the horn will work intermittently.  The key to getting it to work seems to be to take my finger and apply downward pressure at the base of the green tube into which the contact button and spring are installed.  This is making me think there is some loose or dirty connection somewhere, but I am not sure what the guts of the assembly look like.

Any suggestions?

[Grand73Am]

Is the green tube into which the horn contact button and spring go somehow connected to what is called the "cancel cam?"

Yes, it's part of the cancelling cam, which also doubles as the horn contact. This thread shows you what's underneath: http://transamcountry.com/community/index.php?topic=24962.0

[Bull]

Pretty sweet thread.

Guess I need to find a tool to compress the lock plate so I can get under there.

You reckon the horn contact under there is just dirty, or worn?

[Grand73Am]

Yes, if you google steering column lock plate tool, you'll see a bunch of them. They don't cost much. One of your local auto parts stores like NAPA should have it. Or Autozone has a tool lending service if you don't want to buy one, if they have it.
I can't think of anything else it could be but a worn or dirty contact. Also, the Pontiac service manual has instructions for servicing a steering column.

[Bull]

Turns out, my little horn pin/spring/collar assembly was installed incorrectly.  I had left it the way I found it when I took the wheel off.  Turns out, someone along the line had put it back together wrong, and I just didn't know any better.  It was in the order of spring, collar, pin, with the large side of the pin facing out.  It should have been spring, pin, collar, with the large side of the pin facing down and the narrow side extending out of the cancel cam tube about 1/2" or so.  At least, that's what I was told elsewhere today.

I want to get that black plastic cover off of the column so I can get to the retaining ring and plate, but prying from the slots just seems to bend things.  The thread on here that shows how to take one of these columns apart says to pry from those slots, though.

[Grand73Am]

The black plastic cover should just pry off with a screwdriver in those slots around the edge. That will uncover themetal  lock plate for which you'd need the lock plate depressing tool to get the snap ring off, if you want to get the lock plate off.

[Bull]

The black plastic cover should just pry off with a screwdriver in those slots around the edge. That will uncover themetal  lock plate for which you'd need the lock plate depressing tool to get the snap ring off, if you want to get the lock plate off.

So, just go gangbusters on the plate without fear of breaking the old plastic, eh?  Ok...worst case scenario I guess I just buy one in the classifieds here! 

Just seemed to want to twist and bend when I was prying on it before.  But maybe I was just being a wiener about it.

Also: thanks for getting my back with all these questions.  Although 2nd gens are wildly popular, the traffic on the 2nd gen sites seems to be pretty low in some of the tech sections.

[Grand73Am]

Since you've corrected the install of your horn contact pin, spring and collar, does it not work well now? If so, you wouldn't have to take it apart any more.

[Tin Indians Rule]

I hate to jump in here but isn't he missing the big white collar with the copper ring that touches the pin sticking up through the plate??? If memory serves me correctly that pin doesn't protrude very far out of the plate. There is a white plastic collar that fills the void actuating the horn once the horn button is pressed??

Like this one.


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